Trixology

General Category => General Computing/Macintosh => Topic started by: elagache on September 18, 2018, 10:49:13 PM

Title: Mojave?? Remember!! You are askin' for it!
Post by: elagache on September 18, 2018, 10:49:13 PM
Dear WeatherCat followers of da' cult of Apple,

It is official, macOS Mojave is going to "hit the Internet" this coming Monday.  This should raise two somewhat independent issues for the WeatherCat community:


As a general rule, upgrading operating systems is easier on newer hardware and on systems with fewer and newer applications.  Potential problems increase for older Macs and for Macs with many applications - especially older ones.  So that's one way to look over the problem.

In the past, Stu has recommended against installing a new version of macOS until at least the first round of bug fixes.  Stu is extremely busy these days so should WeatherCat have issues with Mojave, he might not be able to fix it as fast as in the past.

In the end it is your decision and your decision alone.  However, when it comes to upgrading your Mac that runs WeatherCat basically you need to decide if reliability is more important than being up-to-date.  Many of us take great pride in uploading data to various sources and keeping our websites on line.  You need to decide how much you want to risk that by upgrading to Mojave.

As is true for any operating system upgrade make sure you have confirmed that your system is healthy.  Make sure your backups are valid, and at the very least, run Disk First Aid on all your disk drives before upgrading.

Every time Apple updates macOS we have a few people come to the forum with various sad stories about how their WeatherCat installation no longer works.    :(

;) . . . This time beware!  You have been forewarned! . . . (http://www.canebas.org/WeatherCat/Forum_support_documents/Custom_emoticons/computer_sock_it_to_me.gif)

Cheers, Edouard    [cheers1]

P.S. Believe it or not, I just went through the operating system grind and finally am running High Sierra.  My thinking was that this was the last easy opportunity to do this and I didn't want to fall more than one version behind the current version of macOS.  So far my system is mostly weathering the change except that my WC AppleScript Tags Processor is reporting a very mysterious missing file error.  Adding to the mystery is that file is exactly where is it supposed to be.  These are the sorts of surprises to expect on any OS upgrade.
Title: Re: Mojave?? Remember!! You are askin' for it!
Post by: xairbusdriver on September 19, 2018, 01:11:11 AM
I’m always surprised at people who think it’s kewl to be the first ont the block to install ‘updates’! [rolleyes2] Seems like the digital equivalence of Russian Roulette! I’m so paranoid, I still compress most of my important apps before updating them! Unzipping is still faster than Time Machine! [tup] cmu:-)
Title: Re: Mojave?? Remember!! You are askin' for it!
Post by: Blicj11 on September 19, 2018, 05:11:32 AM
I plan to install it on my wife's iMac first and see what blows up. She will love me for it.
Title: Re: Mojave?? Remember!! You are askin' for it!
Post by: Alan Rowley on September 19, 2018, 02:33:37 PM
A word of warning that upgrading applications can also bring problems.

Yesterday I updated Safari to the latest version and now I cannot view my HikVision cameras on my Mac. The new version of Safari is not compatible with the HikVision plug-in.

Beware.
Title: Re: Mojave?? Remember!! You are askin' for it!
Post by: Blicj11 on September 19, 2018, 03:31:20 PM
Mojave (through Safari) will no support extensions that are not Apple-verified. Apple says this is a security measure. Unverified third-party extensions can be dangerous by way of hosting malware or even data extraction tools — which could give malicious entities access to your passwords and other sensitive information. Therefore, when you update to the latest version of Safari, which is the one that you will need to run in Mojave, you will lose the use of any of your installed extensions that did not come from the Extension Gallery or that were not previously verified by Apple. For example, I was using an extension that blocked auto-playing videos on websites, but it no longer works in the new version of Safari (12.0). Eventually, at some as of yet unspecified future date, Apple likely ditch their whole Extension Gallery and allow only app-related extensions that come from the App Store. Whilst I am not happy about the loss of legitimate extensions, I appreciate Apple taking my data security and privacy seriously.
Title: Re: Mojave?? Remember!! You are askin' for it!
Post by: xairbusdriver on September 19, 2018, 05:27:25 PM
Quote
I plan to install it on my wife's iMac first
I know that you are NOT a fool, so you must be a very brave man!! cmu:-)

In another 'support' forum, a couple of members have reported that Safari 12 disables extensions without any notification. Since that is one of my most used apps, I'm waiting for further news and a possible update. OTOH, this may simply be Apple's way of tightening security on apps that face the interweb. There should be better communications about what updates will do, however.

You will also see a "request" to you to read the new Media Services Terms & Conditions should you want to update the newer versions of Pages, Numbers and Keynote. It is particularly interesting to note that the only paragraph displayed in ALL CAPS is the one on warranty. It basically absolves Apple of any and all responsibility from any lack of suitability or even damage caused by their software. It is sold "AS IS", 'YOU AT YOUR OWN RISK', period. That's not really different than any other software company, but it is a good reminder that software is a different kind of "product" than just about anything else we "purchase". And we tend to forget that we don't actually "purchase" most software, anyway—we simply license it. :)
Title: Re: Mojave?? Remember!! You are askin' for it!
Post by: Weatheraardvark on September 19, 2018, 07:54:47 PM
Know Thy Self.. and I know myself.   I will wait until it shows up in the app store to upgrade.   Since I use Weathercat for data and do not use it to directly go to a website,  I am going to gamble  and say that if it is a 64 bit app it will work.   I will be back eventually giving you my sob story.

I know it is best to wait until the dust settles and 5 million people have written in to Apple saying this and that doesn't work.    Speaking of that I updated my 8Plus to IOS 12 and dont notice much difference.  I think I am not going out and buy the latest phone and watch  because we all know that in April, they will be revised or terminated.

I guess the best answer is,  to wait until idiots like me   have Mojave and report it works or  is a dismal disaster.  then wait two weeks more. [lol2]
Title: Re: Mojave?? Remember!! You are askin' for it!
Post by: xairbusdriver on September 19, 2018, 08:09:14 PM
Quote
wait until idiots like me have Mojave and report it works or is a dismal disaster.
But... BUT!!! What if it's so bad that they can't get on the interweb to report???!!!! We should all exchange phone numbers!!! Preferably land line numbers!!! :o 8) [goofy]
Title: Re: Mojave?? Remember!! You are askin' for it!
Post by: Blicj11 on September 19, 2018, 08:24:24 PM
I think you are right about the 64-bit apps. Mojave is the last operating system from Apple that will allow 32-bit apps to run, but they will launch with a warning that they will slow down your system, or generate nuclear fallout, or increase the inflation rate, or cause small children to be repelled by your computer, etc.
Title: Re: Mojave?? Remember!! You are askin' for it!
Post by: xairbusdriver on September 19, 2018, 08:40:33 PM
 [lol]
Quote
cause small children to be repelled by your computer
Are you saying that is a problem?! Sounds better than a strong password to keep those tiny fingers away from the keyboard!!!
Title: Re: Mojave?? Remember!! You are askin' for it!
Post by: xairbusdriver on September 20, 2018, 02:33:57 PM
I don't think Stu's suggestion has anything to do with WC. It's a widely held opinion by many developers and users. The problem is usually not with an app, it is with the difficulty of testing an massive collection of code called an Operating System with the almost infinite possible combinations of hardware and software on users system. There are reasons why even Apple states that users of their software do so "at their own risk" and that the software is licensed "AS IS" (the all CAPS is the way the text is displayed in their Terms of Service, btw, not just the way I typed it). Believe it or not, all of Apple's operating systems still have 'bugs' in them. Secondly, many developers have to create work arounds in their apps to overcome some of those bugs. [computer] Fortunately, good developers like Stu are very good at that task and we sometimes don't even know they've protected us from Apple's bugs. I think we should also remember that WC is not actually how Stu "keeps food on the table." [lol]

I'm sure WC has been tested on most, if not all, the Mojave ßetas. I have no concerns about running WC on Mojave. But I will not be installing the new OS for at least a few weeks. I might not be using High Sierra now if the hardware had not died last Spring! [rolleyes2] I have not even put Sierra on my wife's MBP! [blush]

"Maybe I'm paranoid, but that doesn't mean someone is not out to get me!" "I may be wrong, but I don't think so. It's a jungle out there!" cmu:-)
Title: Re: Mojave?? Remember!! You are askin' for it!
Post by: xairbusdriver on September 21, 2018, 05:11:25 PM
In other news, Apple has seeded developers with the first build of iOS12.1. Can you remember when 12.0 was released? [rolleyes2] As Mr. Lincoln once said:"Every program has at least one bug.

Every program can be reduced in size by at least one line.

Therefore, every program can be reduced to a single line - which is a bug."
Title: A sage Murphyism (Re: Mojave?? Remember!! You are askin' for it!)
Post by: elagache on September 21, 2018, 09:44:27 PM
Dear X-Air and WeatherCat collectors of programming wisdom,

In other news, Apple has seeded developers with the first build of iOS12.1. Can you remember when 12.0 was released? [rolleyes2]

As can be found on one of the volumes collecting that various Murphy's laws and their kinfolk: 

 ;) . . . If debugging is the way you remove bugs from a program, then programming must be the way to add new bugs to a program!   cmu:-)

Cheers, Edouard  [cheers1]
Title: Re: Mojave?? Remember!! You are askin' for it!
Post by: wurzelmac on September 24, 2018, 03:48:57 PM
I've always been brave to upgrade when a new system approaches, but this time... my Mac mini Mid 2011 is simply not capable the desert of Mojave.
Title: Re: Mojave?? Remember!! You are askin' for it!
Post by: xairbusdriver on September 24, 2018, 04:06:05 PM
Quote
my Mac mini Mid 2011 is simply not capable the desert of Mojave.
You should get a "new" one, they were built in 2014! [rolleyes2] [computer] My 2011 model died early this year and that's the only reason I upgraded to macOS 10.13 High Sierra on it... Apple did that for me... :P
Title: Re: Mojave?? Remember!! You are askin' for it!
Post by: wurzelmac on September 24, 2018, 04:45:26 PM
xair,
no no no... my mini won't die until a "new" mini is born.  cmu:-)
Title: Re: Mojave?? Remember!! You are askin' for it!
Post by: Weatheraardvark on September 24, 2018, 10:37:19 PM
I made the jump.   I also have the fusion APFS.. had to look for that.      WeatherCat works just fine.   It was initially a little slower but I think it needed to find any new location or protocol.  But it does work.

Took about 2 hours to get up and running.

This is a good little start up to watchhttps://9to5mac.com/2018/09/24/macos-mojave-top-features-changes-video/?pushup=1 (https://9to5mac.com/2018/09/24/macos-mojave-top-features-changes-video/?pushup=1)

On suggestion, do clean extra photos and crap off your computer before updating. Be sure things are turned off such as Weather cat , messages, etc.    the more free disk space you have the better.  The download is 8.5gb   

But for me things are working right now until I tinker and screw the up.
Title: Re: Mojave?? Remember!! You are askin' for it!
Post by: Blicj11 on September 24, 2018, 11:00:34 PM
Thanks for the update. So I assume that your APFS conversion came off well with no problems. That is great news for us Fusion Driver owners.
Title: Thanks for the confirmation (Re: Mojave??)
Post by: elagache on September 24, 2018, 11:11:54 PM
Dear Weatheraardvark, Blick, and WeatherCat faithful,

I made the jump.   I also have the fusion APFS.. had to look for that.      WeatherCat works just fine.   It was initially a little slower but I think it needed to find any new location or protocol.  But it does work.

Thanks for the confirmation Weatheraardvark.  We had some positive reports from people running the beta, but your's is the first confirmation of the finished product.  Since you have a Davis station that is at least one product line that has successfully made the jump.

Cheers, Edouard  [cheers1]
Title: Re: Mojave?? Remember!! You are askin' for it!
Post by: dfw_pilot on October 04, 2018, 02:29:00 PM
On suggestion, do clean extra photos and crap off your computer before updating. Be sure things are turned off such as Weather cat , messages, etc.    the more free disk space you have the better.

Completely agree with this!

From an earlier post (http://athena.trixology.com/index.php?topic=1986.msg18301#msg18301):

Quote
A best practice is to keep your system files on one volume (OS X) and your data on a second volume. That way, when you install a new version of OS X and it all goes pear-shaped, you haven't a worry about your data being corrupted. An example from my own system is to have a small, internal 120gig SSD that OS X is installed on, and my 16 terabyte Thunderbolt Raid holds all my data. The two never come in contact, and for good reason: updates, installs, and reinstalls are done without worry of OS X trying to mess up my data files (photos, documents, etc).
Title: Re: Mojave?? Remember!! You are askin' for it!
Post by: Steve on October 04, 2018, 03:22:01 PM
I moved both the 2017 4K iMac and 2016 MBP to Mohave yesterday. Other than more permissions to set with third party software, it was pretty anti-climactic. I really was expecting several applications to no longer work, but after launching every single one on both computers, not a single failure to launch.

Easy peasy!
Title: Re: Mojave?? Remember!! You are askin' for it!
Post by: Weatheraardvark on October 04, 2018, 06:48:54 PM
IP cameras.    All of my IP cameras do not run under Mojave.   I think it is some security function.  weird
Title: Re: Mojave?? Remember!! You are askin' for it!
Post by: xairbusdriver on October 04, 2018, 09:27:50 PM
Quote
All of my IP cameras do not run under Mojave.
Thanks for the info. Please keep us updated! BTW, what specific brand(s) are you using? Do they have any other to connect (WiFi, USB, etc.)?
Title: Re: Mojave?? Remember!! You are askin' for it!
Post by: Blicj11 on October 05, 2018, 05:39:19 AM
I moved both the 2017 4K iMac and 2016 MBP to Mohave yesterday. Other than more permissions to set with third party software, it was pretty anti-climactic. I really was expecting several applications to no longer work, but after launching every single one on both computers, not a single failure to launch.

Easy peasy!

Thanks for the update, sir. Good to know our early adopters are adopting and mostly pleased.
Title: Re: Mojave?? Remember!! You are askin' for it!
Post by: Weatheraardvark on October 05, 2018, 01:44:21 PM
Quote
All of my IP cameras do not run under Mojave.
Thanks for the info. Please keep us updated! BTW, what specific brand(s) are you using? Do they have any other to connect (WiFi, USB, etc.)?
These are Foscam.   They used to work,   I could call them up on Safari,but even the plugins that used to work with Safari won't work.   I thinkI probably will put them into a box.    A while back security was a concern with the foscam Chinese made camera.  maybe they are concerned about it, or it will come in a later update.

Title: Re: Mojave?? Remember!! You are askin' for it!
Post by: xairbusdriver on October 05, 2018, 02:56:43 PM
I think 99.5% of these cameras are from China. ;) However, I don’t think they normally require any kind of drivers. Of course that brand might. When I finally install Mojave I will find out, but I am emailing the distributor in a few minutes about compatibility with the new OS. Will post the answer here.
Title: Re: Mojave?? Remember!! You are askin' for it!
Post by: dfw_pilot on October 05, 2018, 02:59:14 PM
Agree with Xair - keep the firmware up to date and you should be fine. Hopefully they come out with a firmware update for them soon.
Title: Re: Mojave?? Remember!! You are askin' for it!
Post by: Steve on October 05, 2018, 04:18:42 PM
Quote
All of my IP cameras do not run under Mojave.
Thanks for the info. Please keep us updated! BTW, what specific brand(s) are you using? Do they have any other to connect (WiFi, USB, etc.)?
These are Foscam.   They used to work,   I could call them up on Safari,but even the plugins that used to work with Safari won't work.   I thinkI probably will put them into a box.    A while back security was a concern with the foscam Chinese made camera.  maybe they are concerned about it, or it will come in a later update.

For those of you using Sharx Security IP cameras and contemplating upgrading to Mojave, rest assured that they work fine, either addressing directly through Safari or with specific software such as SecuritySpy. I have abandoned EvoCam, so I cannot address that question.
Title: Re: Mojave?? Remember!! You are askin' for it!
Post by: Weatheraardvark on October 05, 2018, 04:49:36 PM
Quote
All of my IP cameras do not run under Mojave.
Thanks for the info. Please keep us updated! BTW, what specific brand(s) are you using? Do they have any other to connect (WiFi, USB, etc.)?
These are Foscam.   They used to work,   I could call them up on Safari,but even the plugins that used to work with Safari won't work.   I thinkI probably will put them into a box.    A while back security was a concern with the foscam Chinese made camera.  maybe they are concerned about it, or it will come in a later update.

The bizarrness continues.  For some reason I got the idea to reboot my modem again.    All of the IP cameras came back online, checked with the modem and all the IP addresses are there as well. I can even get Directv.com to work again.    The plug ins do not work, so I asked Foscam for advice. 

I wonder if after installing. Mojave, and the computer restarts,   perhaps rebooting the modem as well clears stuff up?   I have a Zyzel. with centurylink dsl.  Normally it is fine, but since the June 30 flood, the podium their modem sat on took a hit and we were without internet for a few days while it was repaired.   Since then things have been wonky at times.    I am mentioning that as it seems  that tracking back from WC. when things do not work well all the way back to the modem and even a call to the provider isn't too bad, just to check  and eliminate.

So. all I need to do is let my thumb heal (had surgery last week,  doing fine). and get my tailbone in order (might have a stress fracture,  ).  and we are going to be just fine.
Title: Re: Mojave?? Remember!! You are askin' for it!
Post by: xairbusdriver on October 05, 2018, 05:02:22 PM
From Sharx Security, Customer Support (within 7 minutes of my email to them!):
Quote
No reports of any issues yet, other than Chrome needing to be specifically enabled to use Flash for each camera's IP address.
Title: Re: Mojave?? Remember!! You are askin' for it!
Post by: Blicj11 on October 05, 2018, 05:17:22 PM
For those of you using Sharx Security IP cameras and contemplating upgrading to Mojave, rest assured that they work fine, either addressing directly through Safari or with specific software such as SecuritySpy.

Good to know, Steve. Thanks for sharing.
Title: Re: Mojave?? Remember!! You are askin' for it!
Post by: Blicj11 on October 05, 2018, 05:20:18 PM
So. all I need to do is let my thumb heal (had surgery last week,  doing fine). and get my tailbone in order (might have a stress fracture,  ).  and we are going to be just fine.

Ouch. How about a little "take it easy?"
Title: Re: Mojave?? Remember!! You are askin' for it!
Post by: Weatheraardvark on October 05, 2018, 05:44:17 PM
So. all I need to do is let my thumb heal (had surgery last week,  doing fine). and get my tailbone in order (might have a stress fracture,  ).  and we are going to be just fine.

Ouch. How about a little "take it easy?"

at my age, I am going to take it anyway I can get it.

I did get this from Foscam:Sorry, the newest Safari blocks the camera’s plugin, please go to https://www.foscam.com/downloads/app_software.html download the VMS software to manage your cameras. Thank you.

Best Regards,
 
Stephen Lei
Customer Service Representative
 
Title: Is your modem also an IP router? (Was: Mojave??)
Post by: elagache on October 05, 2018, 10:54:40 PM
Dear Weatheraardvark and WeatherCat homeowners with more of a local area network than they imagined,

The bizarrness continues.  For some reason I got the idea to reboot my modem again.    All of the IP cameras came back online, checked with the modem and all the IP addresses are there as well. I can even get Directv.com to work again.   
. . . . .

Does your modem also act as an IP router that assigns IP addresses via DHCP?   If so it is possible that the router got hung up somehow and wasn't assigning IP addresses to your devices.  That is one way to produce the symptoms you were observing.  These IP routers are basically little computers in their own right so they can get hung up when something goofy happens that their firmware cannot handle.

Cheers, Edouard  [cheers1]
Title: Re: Is your modem also an IP router? (Was: Mojave??)
Post by: Weatheraardvark on October 05, 2018, 11:12:59 PM
Dear Weatheraardvark and WeatherCat homeowners with more of a local area network than they imagined,

The bizarrness continues.  For some reason I got the idea to reboot my modem again.    All of the IP cameras came back online, checked with the modem and all the IP addresses are there as well. I can even get Directv.com to work again.   
. . . . .

Does your modem also act as an IP router that assigns IP addresses via DHCP?   If so it is possible that the router got hung up somehow and wasn't assigning IP addresses to your devices.  That is one way to produce the symptoms you were observing.  These IP routers are basically little computers in their own right so they can get hung up when something goofy happens that their firmware cannot handle.

Cheers, Edouard  [cheers1]

Yes,  the Modem has a router inside, and I do have an external switch for my Weatherlink IP (2). and some other things.     It is an zyzel q1000. .    takes now forever to reboot.   I have it on an USP, but. the thing doesn't automatically go find the DSL on an outage