Steve & Deb's Cross-Country Adventure

[elagache]

Dear Steve and WeatherCat vacation daydreamers,

Oh, don't get me wrong, Edouard. I'd love to have an old Airstream. But they've gained the attention of the trend-setters and hipsters today, and have skyrocketed on price. As a kid, I spent most summers traveling the eastern US in an Avion trailer with my grandparent, and cherish those memories.

So you've noticed also! . . . .

I've been watching the prices on eBay and also on some dedicated classified sites.  The price seems dictated more by the amount of work that has been done to the trailer.  A fully restored trailer can fetch over $50,000.  However, it does appear that these prices close to and some cases less than the actual cost of the work required.  There appears to be a problem that is analogous to classic cars.  The cost of labor is such that a restoration is more expensive than you can realistically hope to get for the restored vehicle.

(Avion were the non-polished competition for Airstream. The General Manager for Airstream lived across the road from my parents, so there was always the latest and greatest parked there. The Airstream factory was only 18 miles from where I grew up in Bellefontaine, Ohio.

I have been trying to educate myself about the competitors of Airstream because they tend to be less expensive.  However, they are so rare that this isn't the advantage I would have hoped.   

. . . . Too bad your parents couldn't persuade the manager to bring home an extra a "factory sample," otherwise you might still have it to this day! . . . 

Cheers, Edouard 

[Steve]

We leave tomorrow! I don't feel the least bit ready. Who knew it took so much non-school related stuff to go to college!

We will be taking off around 1:00 PM, so we don't have to rush the final loading in the morning to get through Chicago before rush hour. We'll mosey along, and take the southern route on the map above, through Iowa. We'll stop somewhere around Davenport the first night.

Then up to South Dakota, and spend a day wandering around what we can get to in a reasonable time. At least Mount Rushmore. Then on toward Seattle.

I'll post a photo tomorrow just before we head out on the road.

[WCDev]

We kinda liked this one (click the east side of the map, then 220RBI
http://www.keystonerv.com/bullet/

It is designed for two people to travel comfortably, rather than the norm of seeing how many beds you can squeeze into a trailer.

Very nice, but quite heavy? Ours comes in at about 1.6T fully loaded; I think that one comes out at just over 2?

Having said that, the slidy outy lounge bit is interesting; we don't have anything similar here on caravans (well, not that I've ever seen).

[elagache]

Howdy Stu, Steve, and WeatherCat caravan fans,

Very nice, but quite heavy? Ours comes in at about 1.6T fully loaded; I think that one comes out at just over 2?

You are correct Stu.  The big difference between the United States and Europe is the existence of large SUVs and pickup trucks.  These vehicles can easily handle up to 10,000 lbs or 5 short tons.  That's why there are many trailer designs that easily exceed 30 feet and are made of heavier fiberglass.

Having said that, the slidy outy lounge bit is interesting; we don't have anything similar here on caravans (well, not that I've ever seen).

I don't know when this sort of slide-out design was first used but it has become a highly sought-after feature.  Even Airsteam uses this design.  While it is certainly practical, I wonder about the integrity of the trailer shell.  Certainly you can make a much stronger design that weighs less with continuous body.

Cheers, Edouard

[WCDev]

My Landy says it's ready to take on any of yours any time, any place

Seriously though, I'm not sure I want to tow anything with a mass greater than 100% of the towing vehicle (assuming the trailer is braked) - our Landy is approx. 2.5t, so is fine up to that although it's rated up to 3.5t - not sure I'd want to actually tow that much!

 

[elagache]

Howdy Stu and WeatherCat "serious" tow vehicle fans . . .

My Landy says it's ready to take on any of yours any time, any place

Well, I don't think your "Landy" would win in a tug of war with a modern US SUV, but I just checked the specs of the 2016 Chevy Suburban and they are definite less than what they were just a few years ago when I last looked into this:

http://www.chevrolet.com/suburban-suv/specs/trims.html#

The tow capacity is dropped to 8000 lbs. when it was 10,000 no more than 2 years ago.  Also the engines are definitely less powerful.  However, all is not lost.  Now the Suburban comes with available WiFi and 14 electronic device charging ports! . . . .

No wonder I'm feeling like I'm about to be run of the road by distracted drivers . . . . .

Seriously though, I'm not sure I want to tow anything with a mass greater than 100% of the towing vehicle (assuming the trailer is braked) - our Landy is approx. 2.5t, so is fine up to that although it's rated up to 3.5t - not sure I'd want to actually tow that much!

I agree that's more prudent, but I'm definitely going to be pushing my luck with any Airstream travel trailer larger than 16 feet.  Alas, the smallest Airstreams are so small that you have to go outside to change your mind.  As they get larger then they outweigh my wagon.  I'm hoping to cope with this by getting the smallest twin axle trailer I can find and equip it with modern disc-brakes so that the trailer should have roughly the same stopping capacity as my wagon.

As crazy as this scheme appears to be, I know of one fellow using the same wagon model as mine who traveled over 3000 miles with drag-race car on a trailer as the payload:

https://gmcguy.shutterfly.com/pictures/622

At one point he stopped at a truck scale and his total consist was 10,000 lbs.  The wagon is 4000 lbs. so the drag-car car plus trailer must have been 6000 lbs.  I've gone through his story in gory detail and tried to correct every misfortune he ran into.  I'm not there yet, but it does seem possible that my wagon can tow the smallest of the twin-axle trailers of the period.  I'll just have to be very careful and avoid all those distracted driver!!

Cheers, Edouard

[xairbusdriver]

All this travel trailer talk is reminding me of our little single axle model we had back in the early 70's. The most efficient method today, fifth wheel type, is not as new as many think. Have any of you ever owned a "Shadow" trailer?
<Might be hard to find parts, but I think you could fit one on your wagon!> Frankly, I always worried about the trailer turning my car into a convertible!

Alas, when I left the United States Aerospace Force, we thought our very uncertain future (with a new, "fly-by-night" freight airline) made it safer to sell the little, cold water only, shower-less little trailer.

From the driving I've done in Europe/Ireland/England, I don't think I'd want to pull any kind of trailer like we have on this side of the pond! The Romans simply didn't make the highway rights-of-way wide enough!! :Perhaps using only the M and A roads only would be safe... 

[Steve]

Thanks, everyone,

We left way late on the 18th, and made it to Indiana, just short of Chicago. Saturday, we got to Des Moines, Iowa, and this evening, to Rapid City, South Dakota. We need to do 600 miles each of the next two days, so doing a quick drive-by of Mount Rushmore, in the morning, and we'll be back this way to see it better, along with everything else in the area, on our return trip.

I'll get photos when I can on here, but we've been posting on Instagram, which then gets sent to Facebook and Twitter.check over there via the links posted earlier in this thread.

Steve

[Blicj11]

Seriously though, I'm not sure I want to tow anything with a mass greater than 100% of the towing vehicle (assuming the trailer is braked) - our Landy is approx. 2.5t, so is fine up to that although it's rated up to 3.5t - not sure I'd want to actually tow that much!

Amen. Several years ago, I was towing a 24 ft cargo trailer with a Chevrolet Suburban that was outweighed by the cargo load. I was driving along minding my own business on the motorway when I was overtaken by a large lorry pulling a trailer. The lorry was travelling  about 20 mph above the speed limit and when it went past me, the turbulence whipped my trailer back and forth and it eventually tipped over on it's side. The police came and gave me a ticket for failure to control my vehicle. The whole episode was the result of pulling a trailer that largely outweighed my vehicle.

... so doing a quick drive-by of Mount Rushmore, in the morning, and we'll be back this way to see it better, along with everything else in the area, on our return trip.

I have always wanted to see Mount Rushmore but have never been close to the region. I did see Stone Mountain, Georgia, which carving was initiated by the same artist, Gutzon Borglum, in 1923. Although Mr. Borglum did not finish the Stone Mountain memorial, he did develop the techniques there that allowed him to take on Mount Rushmore a few years later.

[elagache]

Dear X-Air, Steve, Blick, and WeatherCat adventurers,

All this travel trailer talk is reminding me of our little single axle model we had back in the early 70's. The most efficient method today, fifth wheel type, is not as new as many think. Have any of you ever owned a "Shadow" trailer?

Hmm, it is an interesting concept.  However, the only way such trailers could have ever been really practical is if the auto makers designed automobiles with hard points to take the tongue weight of the trailer.  I suspect the load equalizing hitch made such extremes not worthwhile because a load equalizing hitch distributes the tongue weight of the trailer on all 4-wheels of the tow-vehicle.  The mechanism is most ingenious as is described here:

http://auto.howstuffworks.com/auto-parts/towing/equipment/hitches/towing-weight-distribution-systems.htm

We left way late on the 18th, and made it to Indiana, just short of Chicago. Saturday, we got to Des Moines, Iowa, and this evening, to Rapid City, South Dakota. We need to do 600 miles each of the next two days, so doing a quick drive-by of Mount Rushmore, in the morning, and we'll be back this way to see it better, along with everything else in the area, on our return trip.

Steve, you and family are indeed having quite an adventure!  I'll do the best I can to follow, but Twitter doesn't seem to be the easiest way to do that.

Hey WeatherCatters, is there some way with the Twitter Mac App to look up another Twitter thread that you have made a favorite?  It seems like something that should be obvious, but I can't seem to find a place on the app that lists the threads I've selected as favorites.  I just double-checked, I have the latest version of the app from Twitter.  What am I missing here?

Amen. Several years ago, I was towing a 24 ft cargo trailer with a Chevrolet Suburban that was outweighed by the cargo load. I was driving along minding my own business on the motorway when I was overtaken by a large lorry pulling a trailer. The lorry was travelling  about 20 mph above the speed limit and when it went past me, the turbulence whipped my trailer back and forth and it eventually tipped over on it's side. The police came and gave me a ticket for failure to control my vehicle. The whole episode was the result of pulling a trailer that largely outweighed my vehicle.

I agree that one is safer with a tow vehicle that weighs as much as the trailer, but it is certainly possible travel safely with some imbalance.  In your case, I suspect the problem was more to do with wind resistance of your cargo trailer.  The streamlined aluminum trailers will have less vulnerability to that.  More importantly, even if you had a tow vehicle that was as heavy as the trailer, how would that have prevented the trailer from whipping back and forth or ultimately turning over?  Once the trailer became destabilized, all you could have done is tried to drive your tow vehicle in such a way as to cancel out the oscillation.

Sadly, I think the lesson from your experience is all too clear to me: the greatest threat we all face is from bad drivers.  About the only technology that is going to cure that is self-driving cars and it breaks my heart that people would prefer to surrender the privilege of driving than to accept the serious responsibilities involved in driving a 2 ton vehicle at 70 mph.  There was a time when people made the effort to drive safely and that dedication combined with a much lower traffic density made automobile accidents extremely rare even if those cars lacked much of the safety technology of today.  So there can be no doubt.  The vast majority of drivers intentionally choose to drive in an unsafe way and because we are a democracy, laws will not be passed to take such people off the road.

Oh well, . . . . Edouard

[WCDev]

Nasty!

I'm not sure something like the AL-KO ATC Trailer Control System would have helped? We have it fitted to ours and in the last 12 months it's sprung into action twice - both times in the Yorkshire dales in nasty weather. http://www.al-ko.co.uk/edit/files/downloads/al-ko-atc-trailer-control-brochure-2010.pdf

[elagache]

Howdy Stu and WeatherCat caravan dreamers, . . .

I'm not sure something like the AL-KO ATC Trailer Control System would have helped? We have it fitted to ours and in the last 12 months it's sprung into action twice - both times in the Yorkshire dales in nasty weather. http://www.al-ko.co.uk/edit/files/downloads/al-ko-atc-trailer-control-brochure-2010.pdf

Thanks for posting this!  I wasn't aware of this sort of technology but suspected something like this had to exist.  I'm a long way from getting a travel trailer and one of the reasons is that once I get my trusty wagon healthy, I'll have educate myself on all the issues associated with operating and maintaining a "caravan" . . . 

Cheers, Edouard

[elagache]

Dear WeatherCat dreamers of travel trailers . . . (I mean caravans  )

Because my bookmarks aren't as logically sorted as I would prefer, I overlooked this maker of small trailers in my previous list:

http://www.riversidervs.net/product-category/retro-models/

While these are currently manufactured, they clearly have a very retro "canned ham" look to them.  They also are small and light enough that some of the models look like they could be towed by Steve's Subaru.  Here is a picture of the Retro 166 as an example:



It looks retro enough that it might look just fine behind my trusty wagon!

Cheers, Edouard

[Blicj11]

Very nice. The only thing I don't like is that it has a single axle. Single axle caravans are a wee bit more difficult to reverse.

[xairbusdriver]

The problem I have is lack of headroom for a 6+ footer! Maybe if I used bigger tires... 

It's not the number of axles that makes backing up "fun", it's the short distance between the pivot point and the wheels. A 53' trailer is very easy to back up, no matter how many axles!